Transcript from Episode 55 – Sex and dating after divorce with Timmy Gibson
Kristen: [00:00:00] All right, everyone, I have a cold. So bear with me. you know, even when you’re sick, the show must go on. So, I want to tell you a little bit about today’s episode. I had Timmy Gibson, who is a fellow life and relationship coach here in Kansas City on. Funny thing is when I did my competitive Intel for my business plan a few years ago in Kauffman FastTrac, he was one of the coaches that I actually did my research on.
We do have a lot in common, but there’s definitely enough differences between us, I think that you know, I don’t, I don’t see people as competition. I see all of us out there trying to just help the community, help people in the world move about their lives healthier and happier, and it’s going to take a village. It takes a lot of us to do that.
I did ask his perspective about something. He used to be a clergy person, so I asked him what he thought about post-divorce, if people should, or need to or, should feel compelled to [00:01:00] go back to, celibacy if that’s what they chose before they got married. It was just an interesting topic to explore with someone who used to be a minister. We talked about divorce, finding those new circles in our lives, kind of building new lives altogether and even some of the stigma that can hold for us as relationship, dating, and for myself, a sex coach. We’ll talk a little bit about our perspectives on failure versus things just ending.
Kristen: On today’s episode of Keep Them Coming, I am joined by Timmy Gibson. He is a life coach and entrepreneur. Um, you can kind of compare him to like a, you know, a modern-day hitch, I suppose. Right? It’s not really about hooking people up, but more about helping people get more in tune with who they are and gain confidence, things like that. That kind of life coaching, right?
Timmy: Yeah. People become the best that they can possibly be. Reaching their full potential. Recognize their [00:02:00] true gifts and yeah.
Kristen: How long have you been doing this?
Timmy: so the life coach thing has been. Rather new though. I’ve been in that role for 20 years.
Kristen: For 20 years you were…
Timmy: …In the church. Yeah. It was a minister. Yeah, it was. I would be considered a pastor and still teach in a spiritual Sunday morning gathering, but it’s just changed considerably from my… Kinda my Pentecostal assembly God upbringing,
Kristen: No more fire and brimstone against the LGBTQ plus community?
Timmy: Oh yeah, hell T no.
Kristen: That was the tipping point for you.
Timmy: Yeah. That was the tipping point for me. I could never resonate and understand or reconcile how being born homosexual was any different than being born heterosexual and why are we deciding that that one is wrong and then this one is right?
I just never could figure that out. You know, I had a bunch of good gay [00:03:00] friends growing up and so. I just never thought there was anything wrong with it. And then of course, you know, in the church they were teaching that it was wrong. And I’m like, really? I don’t get this. And I tried to believe that lie.
And then eventually I could no longer justify living hypocritically. So I came out of the closet and said, I love gays.
Kristen: Thank you! Thank you. Sometimes we have a a long journey to understand what we’ve got to do to be right with our own humanity. So, you know, it is what it is. So well, welcome to the party. I mean, I grew up Baptist. I definitely have said things in my, you know, well, Assembly of God and Baptist…Yeah. They’re not, not all that far apart from that spectrum of super religiosity. This one I grew up in the suburbs was not as extreme as like Westboro Baptist level I hate to even say their name and give them any power, so, yeah. But it was [00:04:00] definitely certain people are going to hell and here’s the long list of them, and it’s okay if we just cherry pick from the book. Like that’s fine…
Timmy: I always think that’s funny how there’s only a few people that go the go to heaven, but it always includes them, of course.
Kristen: Accurate, accurate. So well, tell me a little bit more about your transition out. So, left the church, have made a transition to some life coaching rather than… Do you still do weddings and stuff?
Timmy: Yeah, still do weddings. I do like 60 weddings a year, so yeah, a lot. A lot. Especially during the peak season right now. It’s actually kind of the slower season, but yeah, as soon as we get through all these engagements…
Kristen: Glad you could fit me in your schedule.
Timmy: Yeah, I started doing the life coaching and, it’s been, man, it’s been a journey, you know, cause I feel like I’ve been on a life coaching journey my entire life. Just me personally. And so transitioning into, being [00:05:00] more intentional with it as a, as a profession, if you will, yeah, it’s been a joy.
I’ve always loved helping people, so it’s, it stays within the context of what I’ve always loved doing. And I’ve always been the kind of person, like all my life, I, my sister, God rest her soul, growing up, you know, when I learned how to ride a bus, she was my younger sister. So when I learned how to ride a bike, I wanted to teach her how to ride a bike. When I learned how to ice skate or rollerblade, I wanted to teach her how to do it. Like I’ve always been the kind of person that when I learned something that it works, I’m like, “Oh, this is the shit.” It’s like, I want to tell the people about it. You know?
Kristen: Like, yeah I think I’ve always had that in me too.
Kristen: Yeah, I get that.
Timmy: So, yeah, I mean, right. You’re good at sex. I don’t know this personally, but, like,
Kristen: No, you don’t,
Timmy: you’re good at sex right?
Kristen: however there’s some assumptions to be made… you know, I get asked that question, if I am good in bed, I’ve been asked that in public and I just say yes, but that’s not the point. My job, is to help you be great at sex, so…
Timmy: I love it.
Kristen: Yeah. I mean, I don’t, I take no shame in saying that I’m great in bed. That’s fine.
Timmy: Well, that’s good. That’s it for me. So I feel like I’m [00:06:00] good at life now. That doesn’t mean I’m perfect. Right?
Kristen: To be a coach, I feel like you’ve got to be in a good space. To be a therapist, you’ve got to be in a good space. You have to have dealt with your shit, or at least be on the path to working on certain things.
Kristen: Yeah if you don’t mind telling a little bit more about your personal story.
Kristen: …kinda transitioning out of the church too? You were married for how long?
Timmy: I was married 25 years to the same girl,
Kristen: Same woman…
Timmy: Same woman, and after 25 years we literally hit the 25-year mark and then now I’m divorced. So that was an interesting, interesting journey.
Kristen: I mean, I’m twice divorced. And, my first marriage, we were together eight years. I mean, that’s still quite a significant relationship. So, but yeah, I, you know, when you’re coaching, in the, in the pre-show talk, you brought up something that I do want to discuss, because I’ve been asked this question as well, it is, we’re both out there coaching on relationships,
[00:07:00] Timmy: Right.
Kristen: and, and I think oftentimes, let’s, let’s talk about how, before we get into this topic with relationship coaching, this is not just about how to be good in that relationship. It’s about how to be good to yourself…
Kristen: …so you can be good in the relationship.
Kristen: Ultimately, it’s like personal coaching.
Timmy: Oh, I believe it’s, it would be, well, it’s impossible to have a healthy, happy relationship, if you, yourself are just an utter…
Timmy: Mess. Yeah.
Kristen: Shit show.
Timmy: Right. Right. So yeah, it takes, that’s why it’s so important that, and this is what I teach, I teach, especially when working with singles and doing date coaching is, Hey, the most important thing first is you not this. I say before you’ve tried to find the right person, you need to be the right person. And I think that’s the important thing. It’s not just, I want to find Mr. Right or Mrs. Right. It’s like, well, you, you need to be the right person first.
Kristen: I talk a lot about focusing on what you want, but you’ve got to be those things too. If you want someone [00:08:00] that goes out and is active, you’ve got to be out and be active.
Timmy: If you want someone dependable, you need to be dependable.
Kristen: Exactly. Well, and I’ve been asked the question. Well, you’re divorced and you’re trying to coach people about their marriages. So how does that jive? Like, you know, I take the question in stride because it’s simply like, I kind of started off with the joke of like, well, sometimes I know more of what not to do than what to do, and that’s what people are looking for, right? Like, learn from my mistakes, but put on a more serious note, being divorced, the marriage ended, that doesn’t make us failures.
Timmy: Sure. Right. And working through that, you know, again, raising that religious culture, I was raised to value shame and value guilt. And so I think for me, it’s even something I’m still working through at . This very moment, cause just being divorced last year, and being a, you know, a [00:09:00] very, very small, but, someone that’s pretty well known in the community for being married and being married a long time.
And so, I’ve struggled a little bit with the stigma of, you know, having, I don’t view it this way now, but you know, having failed or, you know, I’ve been divorced, I even tell people I’m legally single. This is what I say. but anyway,
Kristen: Yeah, no I like that!
Timmy: Yeah, no, I keep sticking with it. I just feel better about it. Because sometimes that can have a stigma. And I did struggle with, and I’m really coming at it from the back end of it now, isn’t it? Wow. How can I help others with their relationship when I couldn’t even, you know, keep mine? Of course, I’m like, well, but yeah, you did have 25 years, so, right. Do I look at it as it just ended and not a failure, which I, I’m, I’m, I’m getting there.
I’m getting there. Right. Um, so yes, but I truly can help people with knowing a lot of what to do because I was a good husband and feel like I’m a [00:10:00] really good person. Um, so I definitely can help people understand now both sides of it, you know, um, our divorce was amicable. No, no, lawyers were hired or used or needed.
And so it really did just kind of run its course. And, and we’re friends and we can talk and, um, so, you know, maybe I can help people even on that side, like how to, how to have an amicable
Timmy: ….divorce, like how to do this in a healthy way.
Kristen: Yeah, I was recently talking to someone about how I, I definitely got into this to help people fix or maintain their relationships and make them better. Hopefully avoiding divorce, you know, if the opportunity is there, I absolutely want to help couples with that. So sometimes it is about helping people accept that the relationship has simply run its course. It’s not healthy. Um. And there’s always three options. It’s, you know, stay in, do nothing cause you’re already where you’re at.
Kristen: Inaction is a [00:11:00] choice.
Kristen: Ask for change, demand change, decide what you’d need, and then provide the other person what they need to.
Kristen: Or walk away.
Kristen: You know? So, and if you feel like you’ve explored those options, and you know, the door three is just the last one, and obviously, so I don’t want you to pick that one first. You got to look through the other two first.
Timmy: Yeah. Yeah. That that was the thing,
Kristen: Sometimes acceptance and understanding, you know, that’s the best way to go. If there’s a chance to save it. Hell yeah. I want to help people.
Timmy: Sure. And it’s kind of, it’s really changing my perspective on it all. You know what it’s like how you define the success.
Kristen: Well you probably went through those three options yourself, right?
Timmy: Yes. Yeah. Yep. And it was, it, it came down to it. It needed to just close that chapter in my life and, and move on with the next chapter.
Kristen: Coaching is helping people look through that.
Kristen: I understand that struggle too. I mean, after my second divorce, I was like, who’s to want me now?! Fuck! Can’t put that on a dating profile -twice divorced. And there are still times [00:12:00] where on a first date or a second date, or even while we’re talking, I usually try to do the phone conversation. Before I go on a first date, I’m, I’m a quality over quantity for a state person, although I do go on a lot of first dates, but phone conversations are great just even if it’s 15 minutes, sometimes it turns into like an hour and. there’s still some times shock, uh, through whatever means that they’re like, “Oh, twice divorced? Do tell me more.” First one just didn’t work out after eight and a half years, and second one was my oops marriage, so there you go.
Kristen: Well, I’ve given away, I don’t know if people listen to this before they go on first dates with me, but they might. So… Giving it all away here. Maybe that’s my problem is I give all my, uh, my stats away…
Timmy: Maybe too early. Keep them guessing.
Kristen: I don’t care. I’m an open book. Like you can listen to my podcast if you want to get to know me or you can ask questions in person. That’s up to you.
Timmy: Okay. That brings up a little side skirt here, cause I’m dating, right? I’m in the dating world. And not only do I coach people, but I’m also in that life now.
Kristen: You’re a personality. You’re a public [00:13:00] figure.
Kristen: so like I’m on TV all the time too.
Timmy: It’s a weird thing. It’s weird because,
Kristen: There’s a chance for people to google us,
Timmy: and they know you, like they’ll know when I meet them, they think they know me and I really encourage people, if they’ve never heard of me and they’re going to look me up, I would say, Hey, listen. I said, it’s fine to do that. You’re not going to find anything bad out there, but you’re going to find a lot of stuff that could be old out there. Meaning that was what my thoughts were five years ago, because I put my thoughts. Yeah, I’ve been doing this for so long. I’ve been putting my thoughts out there for a long time.
So if you go searching me out, you might draw a conclusion. Probably what people would think is like, Oh, he’s religious, because that’s been my life for so long that you’ll find a lot of religious content out there, and then you’ll judge me based on that. And it’s like, yeah, but I’m not that fucking dude anymore.
Kristen: So you would consider yourself more spiritual or definitely not religiously affiliated.
Kristen: And there’s a big difference, and I think that [00:14:00] these days, people are judging based on like that first glance at a profile. So are you doing online dating right now?
Timmy: I am. And I’ll jump on it and then jump off of it. I’m just, I’m at the verge of, I’m at the point now I think I’m just going to go off of it and let it just all be organic. Here’s my thing though, I’m a hopeless romantic. So part of my challenge is, and what goes through my brain because I’ve seen all the movies. I love all the movies. That’s my favorite movie genre. I will think to myself, yeah, but what if that girl, not that there’s only one, but you know what if the one that’d be the great fit for me, the one that would be compatible, what if she pops on Bumble and I’m not on there?
So like my mind, you know, that missing that opportunity… That’s why I’m, you know, and people have set me up on dates, or introduced me to somebody. Uh, I always do it. I’m like, Yeah! Like, would you..? Yeah, absolutely. 100 percent. Yeah, I’ll do it. Yeah. Because you never know. Like, you never know.
[00:15:00] Kristen: Introductions, I’ll take more without like a conversation and I’ll kind of like check them out. Yeah. But, um, online, I definitely want the phone call and I definitely check them out online. So, yeah. Um, I actually gave up online dating for the year.
Timmy: Oh, good for you!
Kristen: I did, I gave it had given it up for…
Kristen: Oh, Cheers. Yes. Oh with our waters here… I had given it up for two years and then last year, you know, the end of the year, one of my friends/clients was like, uh, you know, I think that you should just get on and give it a try. She was on Hinge at the time. She’s talked about this on my show. So , she convinced me to get on there and I spent the whole calendar year of 2019 on it. And yeah, I just decided the other day, I was like, Hey, down to Bumble at this point, like but I tried Hinge, uh, Facebook dating… I think that was it this year.
Timmy: Which one’s your favorite?
Kristen: I liked Bumble the best. I did like Hinge at first, but the app like crashed and tried to make me make a new profile, at that point I was like, man, I’ll kind of seeing somebody. So, uh, it was fine.
Timmy: So what, what’s been you, I’m curious, I’m [00:16:00] genuinely curious about this. So no. Online dating, online dating, and then back to now, what’s been the difference in like, well, yeah, when I was online I definitely got more dates? Or
Yeah, I had a ton of first dates. It just, you know, like. A lot of people got to date three or four or five, even, um, saw a couple of guys like over multiple months. But yeah, nothing’s panned out from it. So made some decent connections. There are some people that I’m still chatting with, I saw a lot of friends on there too. Some clients, I actually, one I went ahead and like I told him, I saw you on there. He’s like, I saw you on there too. And I didn’t want to, you know, cause I thought that might be weird. So then I told him, if I see you again, I will swipe so that we can, I wanted to match with them so I could get feedback and maybe even introduce him to someone if a chance was there.
Timmy: I got kicked off two of the sites because I got reported as a stolen profile because I’m locally known, so
Kristen: Oh they thought that…
Timmy: I’m known as a married guy, and so, and I haven’t had one a female friend, she texts me, she goes, Hey, I just want you to know your [00:17:00] profile has been stolen, but I reported you on Bumble. And it really wasn’t public information yet, you know? And so I was like, Oh no,
Kristen: It’s not like we want to run out like “hey, I just got a divorce!”
Timmy: I’m DIVORCED NOW! Yeah. That’s like, I had actually had it for the sane, let’s go do a divorce party. And I was like, I don’t know if I really, I don’t know what I think about it. I mean, again, no judgment to those that do it, but I just was like, no, I don’t want to do, I don’t want to do that.
Kristen: I think that there’s certain times where that’s appropriate. Because some people like leave complete jerks or , women that stole their, you know, money in their heart and their dog. But, um, yeah. You know, in this case, it’s not like it was something noteworthy to celebrate.
Timmy: Yeah right. Yeah. It really wasn’t, I mean,
Kristen: my second divorce, I wanted it. Yeah. We celebrated it. Absolutely. We had a party, and I’ve had a friend that I threw a divorce party for. Absolutely. It was like, yes, you are free! Yeah. In this case, yeah. It’s not what’s appropriate at that time?
Kristen: I agree. [00:18:00] You know, another part about divorce, it’s complicated is just kind of the new life. It’s, it’s, it’s kind of a slow fade out and then all of a sudden you wake up one day and you’re like, “Oh shit, like, everything’s different.”
Timmy: It’s so different. Everything’s different. My, um, you know, getting new friends cause you know, in divorce you lose friends.
Timmy: They have to choose sides or they feel like they do. Um…
Kristen: And some friends just fall away from both of you. Like that’s the thing,
Timmy: Yes, I noticed that too.
Kristen: Like just choose one side. They’d just pull back entirely from both people.
Timmy: Yeah. Yeah. But somebody that’s, it’s like people just don’t know maybe what to say or how to handle it or what to think and, you know, um, it’s like, experiencing someone like in a wheelchair, you know, if you’ve never really experienced that, you just get awkward and weird because don’t know what to do, what to say. And it’s like, no, just be normal. Um. But anyways, so yeah, friends just, they don’t know what to do and what to say and how to comfort or to comfort, and so they, whatever. Uh, so yeah, it’s been a whole congratulations. Right, right. Yeah. I don’t know what to say here.
So, yeah. So I, you know, [00:19:00] moved into an apartment. I live, um, in a really fun area, and I’m meeting new people, making new friendships, trying new things, and I’m kind of leaning,
Kristen: How’s that been going?
Timmy: It’s been great. I just kind of say yes. Like if someone said, Hey, we’re having a house party, want to come over. Yes. Yeah. Yes. I just say yes and it’s, it’s been really nice just, just saying yes to things because, you know, I’m free and, and not that I wasn’t free before, but I mean free… It’s different. Like, I can do what I want, go where I want. I don’t ask for anybody’s permission to do anything. And that was fine that I had to, in the context of a relationship. But, um, you know, now, like I bought all new furniture and I bought what I wanted without, you know what I mean? I’d have to consult anyone on anything from top to bottom.
Kristen: How old were you when you got married?
Timmy: I was 25 so I was married half of my life.
Kristen: Had you had any time to do like the single dude life before 25?
Timmy: Oh, yeah. I mean, I, you know, I was, I was fairly, [00:20:00] extremely, uh, promiscuous.
Kristen: I didn’t mean just that I just said like, being out of mom and dad’s house and out on your own and have a job and
Timmy: Ish. Uh, so moved out of the house when I was 19, uh, went off to seminary. Little side note, I got kicked out of my first seminary. Um, then I left, left that seminary, came back home at like 20. Uh, and then at 21, moved back out to go to the second seminary, uh, that I ended up graduating from. So not really. Yeah, it was. I was, I was basically right out of college life to married life. I graduated college when I was 24, and so then by 25, I was married, and so I hadn’t even started my career. I was, I was working, but I wasn’t doing my career. Uh, which again, has changed now at 50. But anyway, yeah. So, yeah. So I really didn’t.
Kristen: So this is a whole new experience.
[00:21:00] Timmy: It was, you know, that’s why when I do weddings and couples are like, yeah, I’m 32 you know, and he’s 32 31 or whatever. I’m like, good for you guys. I think it’s, you know, I think it’s good that you’ve your what you’ve waited.
Kristen: So you consider that a positive…
Timmy: I do.
Kristen: …getting married later in life?
Timmy: Yes. You know, we’ve all heard those stories and I, and I do. I do. Oh, I feel this is so precious. You know, when I hear the story, “we’ve been together since junior high” or “we’ve been together since high school.” “We were high school sweethearts.” I mean, that touches my heart, but the reality is you’re going to change and a lot of those marriages don’t work out. I would say, I would say it’s, well, I know this statistically that very few of those workout, it’s just that you highlight those on the movies. That’s that those work out anyway. They most typically don’t. And so. I like to work with the couple, especially if they’re younger and be like, Oh, you know, I’m honest with them.
Kristen: Do you do some pre-marital counseling?
Timmy: Or coaching I
Timmy: Oh yes. I would say half 50% of the [00:22:00] weddings I do the premarital, and so I really teach this compatibility piece, which is key…
Kristen: Tell me more.
Timmy: …But know thyself as Socrates says, I said, the key to you making this go the distance and you know you want to be The Notebook marriage – you die together to death do us part? I always say it is about knowing thyself, and it is about compatibility and it’s not just about tickles in the tummy and good sex. All those are important, but it is, marriage is more than that.
Kristen: Yeah. I think it’s about more than shared goals. Those are important. When you talk about compatibility, can we break that down a little bit more?
Timmy: Sure. So how I view it is if, if you love the outdoors, and then that your partner is a home buddy. If they hunt and you’re a vegan. If they are highly religious and and you’re not at like, [00:23:00] that’s the stuff, those big pieces I think are important. You know. Did he have to have every interest the same? Well, of course not. You know, they could like golf and you don’t, I mean, there’s certain things that wouldn’t have to be compatible. But I think those big pieces that I’ve mentioned, I think those need to be pretty damn close for a marriage to go the distance, personally.
Timmy: So I don’t know. How do you break down?
Kristen: I would totally agree. Absolutely. Yeah. You’ve got to look at the bigger pieces. I think that there is something that romanticism has tried to teach us and Esther Pearl talks about this and that that one person has to be everything, and I think it needs to be like within a spectrum of each.
You’re like within the kind of like you’re in, you’re toward the same end of things. Again, like if your partner likes to hunt, maybe you don’t go hunting with them, but when they go deer hunting each season with their brother and their father, you’ll happily like cook the meat. You know, like you like having that part of like, you know, close to that. Um, they like to go golfing. Well, maybe you like to go play [00:24:00] tennis. So , while they’re doing their thing, you’re doing your thing…
Timmy: Or you can drive the cart.
Kristen: Whatever. Yeah. I agree that there’s gotta be similarities. It doesn’t have to be oneness. It doesn’t have to be the exact same, but yeah.
Timmy: 100%. And I also that people get, don’t, it doesn’t work out because they say, you know, irreconcilable differences. Well, I, I’m like, well, I mean, some things are irreconcilable, in my opinion, I think, maybe some people have more on the list of what’s irreconcilable than what I might have on there. Um.
Meaning, if someone is unwilling to change and it’s bad and they’re unwilling to change that, but that’s definitely irreconcilable. I mean, I can’t, I mean, this is what it is. Uh, but, uh, an affair, for example, that’s not irreconcilable. I mean, if that person is willing to, you know, repent for, what she did, and then the other person is willing to, you know, forgive and forget and move on. I mean, then that can work out. And I as a life coach, and even the relationship coach, I have [00:25:00] helped couples walk through those kinds of things and reconcile what some people would think is not reconcilable. Um, but to me, it’s just, to me, it’s just the not changing thing. Like if you’re like, Nope, this is the way I am, I’m not changing. That’s irreconcilable.
Kristen: Mmm hmm. Yes. I agree with you. I want to take a quick break after we come back, kind of the path we’re going down, I want to talk a little bit more about, one of my people I admire is Esther Pearl.
Timmy: I love her.
Kristen: I’d like your thoughts on her. Yeah.
[00:00:00]Kristen: All right, so we’re back. I’m back with Timmy Gibson, who’s a life coach, entrepreneur. Um, yeah, he’s cool guy. So we were talking about something that made me just think about Esther Pearl.
Timmy: Yeah I love her.
Kristen: Good. I’m so glad. She is somebody I look up to. So I just got State of Affairs because I’d only had the chance to thumb through it and I let someone borrow it. They kept it. Someone has my Mating in Captivity copy. I haven’t gotten it back from them. So I finally just bought like two new copies of each. So I’m looking forward to finally finishing State of Affairs, um, but something that she talks about in both books, I mean, Mating in Captivity touches on it, but State of Affairs is actually an entire book about what do you do after there’s been an affair?
Kristen: But where she starts off talking about it, Mating in Captivity is exactly something you said that it doesn’t have to be the end of a relationship just because there’s been an affair and a breach of trust.
It has to be about whether or not you accept or not accept that and move on and truly move past it [00:01:00] and learn from it as a couple because yeah, it doesn’t have to be the end because there’s so many, there’s so many variables, so many variables.
Right. A lot of moving parts.
Kristen: Yeah. There’s been times where people have told me their stories about the affair. I’m like, ditch them. Ditch that person. Right now, it doesn’t matter if it’s male or female because it’s not just men have affairs and it’s not just like bored Housewives either.
Timmy: That’s right.
Kristen: But there’s been other times where I’m like, you know, there’s, I think there’s a chance to actually work through this here.
Kristen: Yeah. If, I couples work through that distinction…
Timmy: Yeah. So I, I’m thinking of one couple, I’ve had multiple couples like this, but this one particular couple, it was… It seemed hopeless. They already had a divorce date. He had, he had an affair, not only had an affair, was with another woman. Uh, so when they first came into my office, it was a last ditch effort of the wife. She had heard about me. Someone told her, you got to get in there and see Timmy. Before you go through with the divorce, you got to get in to see Timmy.
[00:02:00] And, uh, I was flattered. And so they did. They hired me for six sessions. The first session, they pulled their chairs far from each other as they could in the office on either side. He had his arms crossed, turned away from her, and then turned away from me. He didn’t want any part of it. Um, he was with this other woman. Wanted to be with this other woman and didn’t want to be with his wife anymore. And that’s where the session started.
And I remember thinking, fuck. Um, so didn’t start out really pretty. And so the first session was both of them, him or regretfully was there. Um, uh, the next four sessions were just me and her working through what it was going to take to be able to restore this marriage. And I just said it was, I said, well, obviously he’s not here, right? So this is 100% about you. He will be a separate issue. [00:03:00] We need to work on you. And so we worked on her being able to work through the forgiveness trust again, and, and, and, and I gave her a lot of tactics that were very unorthodox, uh, stuff that she could do, and I’m super proud of it, to be honest with you. I said, listen, you guys hadn’t had sex for eight months. During that time is when the affair began. Uh, so it gives a context to your story. I said, uh, he was seduced away. I said, so if you want him back and you want to restore this marriage, he’s not interested, you got to get him interested. And I told her, I said, do you need to seduce him back!
Timmy: And I told her, I said, here’s the thing. I said, here’s what I want you to do. I said, if you’ll listen to everything I tell you, I said, you’re going to have a shot at winning this marriage back. If, but only if, you have the courage to do everything I’m going to tell you to do. I said, I’m a guy. I know what guys like, and so I’m going to give you the secret keys [00:04:00] to a man’s heart, and if and this, this could do it. And it did. They, they’ve, they’ve rekindled, they got remarried, they did the whole thing. They weren’t even divorced, but they got re, they did a whole renewal of vows and they sent me pictures of them in California celebrating on the second honeymoon and all that.
So it went great. But one of the things I told her, I said. Um, forgive him. Don’t hold it against him. You know, don’t use it as a tool to beat him up over the head. And I want you to start sending him sexy pictures. I said, that’s, I said, I know that’s what happened. He got lured away. And if he didn’t tell you that, I, I don’t know that he didn’t tell me that.
I said, but I’m just telling you I’m a guy. I know what happened. So, um. She started doing it. She started, I told her by some cute lingerie, start taking pictures and start doing that stuff. So she did well, it started fucking with them. And I found this out later, like, you know, later, uh, much later. And as a matter of fact, he said he thought I was reading his mail about some things and I said, dude, I’m not reading your mail.
[00:05:00] I’m a guy. I know how we think. And I said, of course, I know how the affair went down. I’m a guy, I know how that would go down. And, and he said, he, I’ll never forget in our session when he finally started meeting with me privately, he goes, “wait a minute.” He goes, “are you the one that told her to send me those pictures?”
And I was like, “yeah.” I said, “that was me.” He was like, “those pictures fucked with me, man.” I was like, “Oh, of course they did.”
Kristen: Yeah, that was what it was meant to do.
Timmy: I knew it would, you know, and he goes, that was the beginning of her capturing me again. I said, well dude,
Kristen: Because people cannot seem to get it through their heads. That the things that you did to win that person are the things you need to do to keep them. And you’ve got to change things up and kind of cycle things in and out.
Timmy: And sex is a big piece of that.
Kristen: Yeah! You gotta have variability, there’s gotta be variety, there’s gotta be [00:06:00] nuance, there’s gotta be novelty, all the things like you talked about a plateau in one of your podcasts.
Timmy: And it happens in a sex life. Here’s, you know, so we’d do blowjobs in the car. We would do all that shit when we were dating or first married, but now we’re not. That’s fucked up. Yeah. What you did to get them, you got to do to keep them. If you were fucking in the car, blow jobs and trying anal and doing all that stuff in the beginning, you better be fucking doing that shit. In the middle and in the end.
Timmy: And even getting freakier and figuring out new shit to try otherwise. Yeah. It’s, that’s why the sitcoms make fun of marriage. They say, if you, if you want to stop having sex, get married, that’s fucked up. I hate that. I hate that. Same.
Kristen: I don’t like TV shows that depict dysfunctional families and marriages. I never like Malcom in the Middle. I mean, we watched Simpsons when I was little, but like, he was just a dope and they loved each other, but you know, I could [00:07:00] not handle shows that showed and I felt like applauded people who like hated their spouses.
Kristen: Yeah. And were bad parents.
Timmy: Yeah. Like if you get married, you get to have just, this is, yep, ball and chain. Fuck that. I don’t think it needs to be like that.
Kristen: There’s so many times where people are like, yeah, well, you know, my, my spouse and I don’t really have sex anymore, and we don’t really communicate anymore. Like that’s just kinda how it goes. I kind of let them go, mmm, no.
Timmy: Doesn’t have to.
Kristen: That’s just something that people tell themselves to feel better about the fact that they’re not doing the things that it takes to work on their relationship properly. And they’re kinda like, ugh…
Timmy: well, they’ll compare it to their other friends that like, well, my buddy that he doesn’t have sex with his wife either. Yeah. And how, how did that, how’s that fucking make that? Right, right. jumped off a cliff. Would you go do that too? I mean, you know, it’s like, what?
Kristen: So who do you admire? Your friend that’s not getting laid? Or your friend that’s like fucking his wife consistently.
Timmy: There you go.
Kristen: Uh huh. Yeah. So maybe you need to figure out how to make that happen.
Kristen: Two-way street. It’s a two-way street. Yep. Figure it out. One of my favorite things to advise clients to [00:08:00] do for variety is just taking turns like, your week, it’s your week to pick out kind of a theme or what we’re going to do that’s maybe, you know, maybe it’s cosplay. And then the next week it’s, having sex in the car.
Kristen: And then the next week it’s doing it in the shower. You know, like finding those ways to like spice it up and just introduce novelty into your sex life. It doesn’t have to be constantly,
Kristen: And Hey, then in between, you’re just having sex in the bed while. Kids are asleep or whatever.
Timmy: Absolutely. Yeah. But it’s like, it’s like, yeah, it’s like, even in sports, you know, it’s, it’s the up the middle and consistent, you know, it’s the base hits. Of course. Yeah. The majority of anyone’s long-term sex life is going to be the more normal. That’s fine. But you have to be intentional about adding in the spice.
You gotta be. I, I’ve, I’ve always told couples once a month. Have a have sex day, meaning that day we’re going to it. It’s going to be super special. We’re busting out the rubber sheets, you know, w, [00:09:00] w, whatever, you know, like make it super intentional. Yes. Most of the time you’re going to have regular, wonderful sex.
All sex is wonderful, and we’re going to have a regular, wonderful sex. It’s going to be great, but then once a month, we’re getting freaky. Once a month we’re getting the handcuffs out or whatever the fuck you’re into. We’re going to get into some fun.
Kristen: I like it.
Kristen: So during one of my workshops that I had, I think you’ll be an interesting person to get a perspective on about this, just because of your religious upbringing and having been in a church, and just, I want to know your perspective about this.
So someone asked me if I coach people about what to do, you know, if they are religious and they’ve gotten a divorce , some feel that that means that they need to go back to celibacy or they’re, they’re struggling with that internal debate of, well, I was raised not have sex until I’m married, does that mean I’m not supposed to have sex unless I’m married?
Timmy: Oh man…I am a good person to ask just because I’ve changed. But
Kristen: Feel free to give me what you used to have to say or what you were told to say or kind of…
Timmy: What I [00:10:00] really think?
Kristen: Yeah, absolutely. Please. I would like both perspectives.
Timmy: So, you know, I was raised, I was trying to remain a virgin till the day I got married. That didn’t work out.
Kristen: I was going to say, that didn’t, that didn’t pan out.
Timmy: No it didn’t.
Kristen: I already know that just from conversations they’ve had before, but thank you for outing yourself. I was raised that way too, and I also did not wait until I was married, so
Timmy: I tried to, but all the people that even teach that, you know, I asked one time I, I asked this, this minister who was teaching on this whole wait thing, and after I went up to
Kristen: Was that purity culture-ish,
Timmy: Yeah it was like the purity ring thing.
Kristen: Cause I got into that too with church.
Timmy: Yeah, and so. That after the service was over, and you know, when I was talking to that preacher that preached that message and I pulled him off to the side, and I don’t know how I would have been mature enough to even think this thought, but I asked him, I said, “so did you wait until you were married?” And he’s like, flubbering… And I remember just thinking, why are we saying to do something [00:11:00] that we don’t even fucking do? Hypocritical…
Timmy: And even the, the, the guy that wrote that book years ago, um, called I Kissed Dating Goodbye.
Kristen: He’s gone back on all that.
Timmy: He’s recanted all that, recanted that book.
Kristen: The thing that I got from church leadership was more of the, like, I regret not waiting for my spouse and you’ll regret not waiting for yours.
Kristen: Yeah. That was how, that was how they would justify it as, you know, it was okay that they had not waited.
Timmy: Right. Yeah, but they’d regretted it. Which, yeah, I kind of, I don’t even believe in regret, honestly. I don’t, I don’t believe in it, and so
Kristen: I do my best. I mean, there’s a couple…
Timmy: I want to learn from my lessons from my past.
Kristen: Right, right. It’s more about. How do you talk to yourself? It’s not about regret isn’t an actual feeling. It’s more of a way that we process something. It leads to regret.
Timmy: Yeah. That’s interesting.
Kristen: Yeah. Yeah. Kind of fear, I don’t think is an emotion. Fear is the byproduct of a bunch of other [00:12:00] things that you’re actually feeling. I think regret is much in the same vein. Um, it’s the culmination of several factors I think.
Timmy: And shame and regret…
Kristen: A big part of it is how you, how you contextualize things. How do you actually think and process through something again its, what was the lesson.
Timmy: Right? Right. Yeah. Yeah. That’s good. Yeah. Cause I think shame and regret can seem to go hand in hand. It’s shame is I, I’m bad. A guilt is feeling bad for what you did. Um, and shame is very, very unhealthy.
Kristen: Shame is very internalized.
Kristen: Right? It’s more about your, your character,
Kristen: Who you are at your core.
Timmy: Cause then you start feeling, I don’t deserve to be in a good relationship or I don’t deserve to be happy. I don’t deserve to be rich. I don’t deserve to be whatever. And it’s a no, you do deserve it. Everybody deserves it.
Kristen: By virtue of you being a good human being on this plane of existence, you deserve good things in this life.
Timmy: Absolutely. And I believe that [00:13:00] wholeheartedly.
Kristen: I actually said that exact thing to somebody after they broke up with me because I kind of had figured out that they just, they didn’t think that they deserved good things in life.
Kristen: Um, they just, um, yeah. They were talking about how they felt kind of privileged about getting some things in life. I was like, Oh, you just don’t really love yourself enough.
Kristen: Yeah. Yeah. And that I just said, like, you’re just a good human beings. You just, by virtue of you being here like you deserve today. That’s
Timmy: 100% yeah.
Kristen: There’s nothing else that is required of you.
Timmy: Right. And that’s that. I think that’s the problem I had with religion is it’s such a, if I do good, I’m good. If I do bad, I’m bad. And I it th th the reality is we’re all human and so good people do shitty things sometimes, but that doesn’t make them a shitty person. Uh, just there’s just a human that did what humans do, which is a lot of good. And then sometimes we do shitty stuff too.
Kristen: And when I say [00:14:00] good and bad, I mean, are you, are you being a positive force for good out there?
Timmy: For good…right, right, right.
Kristen: Yeah, in society. Like if, cause if you’re being negative and you’re sucking everything in for yourself, well that’s when I kind of mean more about good versus bad. It’s more like positive versus negative…
Kristen: or positive energy.
Timmy: Yeah. Yeah. That’s even a concept that I’m trying to work myself out of. Coming out of the religious background, everything was divided into good or bad, you know, God or the devil. Um, and so, you know, I’ve been unraveling a lot of that, that teaching to get myself out of a, a good and a bad. And, uh. You know, and, and get myself more into just, I want to be a positive force, uh, for enlightenment and a positive force for, um, positivity and believing in yourself, knowing that you’re capable of doing the most wonderful things and, and just believing in yourself.
Timmy: You know,
Kristen: Did we finish the question about whether or not you should be having sex after you get, [00:15:00] divorced?
Timmy: Okay. Let’s go back to that. Okay. I, I, I,
Kristen: I love it that we were going down like a rabbit hole, thank you, but.
Timmy: I love it. So, yes, for me, this is a question I’ve, I’ve discussed with . Some of my friends that are still in the religious world, and they’re like, they were even assuming. They said, you know, now that you’re getting a divorce, so are you gonna live celibate until, you know, you marry or whatever. And I was like, hell no. I said, that’s not a… I don’t have that conviction at all. Um, I feel like if I am having sex with someone that wants to have sex with me, then we’re going to do this and it’s going to be wonderful. And it’s a biological, it’s animal. It’s just like, this is great. Like there’s nothing wrong with it.
Kristen: And is there anything in the Bible that says that you’re just not…
Timmy: Not specifically, I’m not sure where we get that, but of course, people in the Bible were getting married at 14 and 15.
Timmy: Well, you know, yeah.
Kristen: And dying after their first child.
Timmy: I mean, right. So this is so different. It’s so different. Um. [00:16:00] So, yeah, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with having sex
Kristen: Well, and isn’t just such an old Testament view and aren’t modern Christians supposed to be living of the new Testament? Like, do you want fire and brimstone or do you want love and forgiveness?
Kristen: Like you can’t go by the laws of Leviticus entirely if you think you, especially, you don’t know. Don’t get me going there because that’s the thing, growing up Baptist, yeah. We knew our Bible verses.
Timmy: Oh sure. Well that’s just it, I mean, I think, you know, I really resonate with it the message of, of Christ, which is the new Testament, this message of Jesus, you know, um, well, regardless of what people,
Kristen: I think was great things in there, there’s also great things in other religious texts is where
Timmy: I come from.
Yeah, absolutely the Buddha, all that, that’s for me, it’s like, rather than saying, Oh, you know. Uh, Jesus must be what he, whatever people believe that he is. It’s like that doesn’t even matter whether he even existed or not, that doesn’t really even matter either. But the message of love, kindness, [00:17:00] forgiveness, and grace and mercy, those are wonderful messages that I think everybody on planet earth can resonate with.
Yeah, forget what, what the, all that religious bullshit. Let’s just take that positive message and live that out. And then especially the message of love, that’s the big one to me, you know? And that would solve a lot of issues if we truly just loved. But,
Kristen: So if a client came to you and, yeah, because coaching isn’t about just talking about our lives. They might ask our opinions, I might say, you know, personally, like, I have my thoughts, but here’s the things to ponder. How would you kind of walk someone through thinking about that choice, about if they’ve come from a religious background and that’s the messaging they’re getting. How do you help them work through that?
Timmy: That’s you’re asking a great question because I’ve been doing this and haven’t, uh, been able to quantify it, exactly. I try [00:18:00] to be sensitive to people’s convictions, um, while challenging them to open their mind some and that maybe their convictions are not their convictions, but they’re the convictions that they were taught and told to have. And so I try to help
Kristen: So more exploring where it comes from?
Timmy: Yes, trying to explore where it comes from, but I try to be careful not to, um, infringe on something that maybe they hold dear. So sometimes I’ll say this. So for you right now, where you are. Maybe you ought to not be having sex on the first date because you’re just riddled with guilt every time that happens. So we need to deal with that before we can actually fix this with this. So maybe, maybe you need to stop that. You need to live more congruent with what you think is right and wrong for you right now. And then let’s talk about why you think that’s right and wrong.
Timmy: So, you know, for me it was a [00:19:00] long process for me to get to the point to feel totally like I, that I feel no hesitation, no guilt at all for living the life that I’m living right now. Um. Whereas one of my friends in particular, a client who is very religious, and in his mind, you know, he’s slipped up and, and had sex on a first date or whatever, and just felt terrible about it. And so it’s like, I just want to be like “Be Free! It’s okay. You don’t need to feel bad. You should feel good.”
Kristen: Or at least understand where that feeling is coming from like, is it that there’s messaging that he’s been given that tells him that he should feel bad or dirty or shameful about it?
Timmy: And that’s true, all of it.
Kristen: Or is it that he sees sex as something that should be more sacred and the fact that he is sharing of himself with someone he doesn’t have any intent of seeing again or seeing in the long run? Does he feel like [00:20:00] it’s just something that’s too precious, too precious for him to give away, but he wanted to get laid like so he felt like his, you know, sexual urges took over. Yeah. I mean, he lowered his standards. Yeah. So maybe that, that’s what I’ve helped people kind of explore a lot.
Timmy: I liked that. That’s an interesting thought, because that’s true. It doesn’t have to necessarily come from a religious background, more of, Oh, well, I consider sex very sacred. Um, and so, but I, for
Kristen: And it’s the sharing of energy
Timmy: Here’s whats wild is,
Kristen: It can still be a one night scene and still it’s still an experience where you’re sharing your energy with somebody.
Timmy: Right. And that’s funny. For me. I guess I would be, and not in the context of my sexuality, but I’m “bi” in the sense of understanding like, I can be okay. I view sex very sacred. It is a very, it’s very sacred. It’s a touching of the souls kind of and to me, but yet, I view that, but I’m also totally cool with meeting someone, if there’s a sexual connection and they want to have sex and I want to have sex, let’s [00:21:00] have sex, and I do it guilt-free. Even though sex is very sacred, like I’m literally able to go either way on that and feel fine either way. You know what I mean? Like I don’t if I did prefer, right, if I did prefer one, I would probably prefer the more sacred part. But I really enjoy sex too, and so I’m cool with having it with someone that wants to have it with me.
Kristen: Same here. Yeah.
Timmy: Cheers to that.
Kristen: Sometimes it takes a lot of work to help people get to that point because of some of the messaging that they’ve received and it’s not like. Oh, okay. I, I totally claim the word slut, like slut hood. Like I don’t care. I’m, I’m all about Amber Rose and like the Slut March and all that, like reclaiming that word, kind of like queer has been reclaimed by the LGBTQ community. Um, but. At the same time, I am about helping people, uh, feel okay to experience pleasure and feel okay with getting out there in the dating world.
[00:22:00] Um, one of my favorite clients, Oh God, I adore her. She’s a widow and she had been married to same person for 25 years, um, or ish and not quite 25, but over 20. Um, and it was just more about that journey through permission to just be a woman in the world again who was even putting the energy out there that she was available. And that has been such a blessing to be a part of watching her go through all that.
Timmy: And it’s a blessing for men that some of the women that I’ve encountered, many have hangups and issues and different things. And then the ones that I’ve met that were more free that were like, “Hey, even though I don’t think I like want to marry you, but I really am kind of for some reason, horny for you and I’d like to have sex with you” kind of thing. It’s so refreshing for me. Like. Yeah. Cool. Like we can like,
Kristen: We can just be adults about it…
Timmy: Cause I haven’t we can just like be
Kristen: Just be adults!
Timmy: Please each other and have a good time and then be friends still. And if we ever do it again, great. If we never do it again, it’s still great. Like we just had a good little time. I’m like, [00:23:00] I love that.
Kristen: Yeah. I had a nice rotation going for a while. I’ve talked about it before on the show, so I know you haven’t really listened to my show, so some of my guests would come on and they’re actually like listeners. So, um, but yeah, I talk very clearly about that, that I, um, had a nice rotation going and I’ve had times where I’ve run into them and I. Um, I don’t think that there’s anybody out there who hates my guts that I’ve slept with in the last few years. I think that everyone is pretty much just like, we’re not a match, or it’s ended amicably, or just kind of like the nice fade away and there’s some other too if they call me derived, be like, yeah, sure, let’s go hang out. You know, have a good time. But, um, yeah, I’ve even joked with, uh, Mayor Lucas that if I ran for office, I think all my former lovers would vote for me.
Kristen: He told me I should run for office. I was like, no, not happening. Nope. Done too many drugs and fucked too many people, I don’t hold any hold [00:24:00] anything back there so.
All right, so this is my erotic tarot deck.
Kristen: So if you cut into three piles for me, cause I’ve already shuffled them there for you, we’re just going to do a one card read for you here, Timmy. Okay, so I would like you to describe what you have here.
Timmy: And butts are my favorite. Seriously, I’m an ass man. No, I’m serious.
Kristen: Describe everything that you feel and see in this card.
Timmy: Uh, femininity, sex, long hair, and a fucking hot body.
Kristen: Okay. And it’s the 10 of water.
Timmy: Auqa, which I love, oceans are my favorite.
Kristen: So she’s standing in a body of water with like one, let me see her long hair and yeah. It’s flowing. Oh. And she’s like, her hair has got like stardust in it and
Timmy: Sparkles in her hair. Her hair looks dreaded.
[00:25:00] Kristen: Okay. What do you feel for the mood of what? The colors of the card?
Timmy: It’s like warm and kind of hot.
Kristen: It’s just like, is it a, you think it’s a sunrise or sunset? I think it’s a sunset.
Timmy: Is it a Sunset?
Kristen: Feels like it. Yeah. It looks like a really like, dreamy, Kansas sunset behind mountains though.
Timmy: Yeah. It’s beautiful.
Kristen: Hey, so the water, so you get the 10 of water. So 10 is like a great number to get. Okay. Water suit is about your imagination, which, uh, it’s also about like cups. Sense of sight and the spiritual and emotional sphere, water controls daydreams, mental images, and the lure of the unknown, and of the exotic and adventurous situations that looks very like adventurous there. The mountain lake at sunset. Um, it’s also part of the attraction which comes from what is irrational and from romantic desires.
Okay. So the 10 being about faithfulness, the perfection of a situation, harmony. Purification. Uh, it’s about Mars in Pisces and the [00:26:00] need to struggle to evolve, to fight in a detached, indifferent and scientific way.
Kristen: And a lot of what you talked about today was kind of that transition that you’ve made in your life from being a married man, to being a single man.
Kristen: Sometimes helping people with that transition or making the decision for that transition and kind of understanding, like changes are a part of life.
Timmy: Yeah. That’s awesome.
Kristen: I think that’s a perfect card for you.
Timmy: That was! That was good. Okay. Yeah. Thanks for doing it. Absolutely.
Kristen: I mean, this conversation was awesome. So I’m sure there’s people who would like to talk to you. And in fact, I mean, I might have some clients who might want their husbands to come talk to you. So maybe you’ve got some, you know, like, we can help each other out here.
Timmy: Hey awesome.
Kristen: Cause I think like tag teaming, some couple… Not like that. Not like that, but,
Timmy: Well, unless they’re open to it…no.
Kristen: Yeah. Nope, Nope. I do get asked that if I do anything with clients and like new, um. It’s, it’s not so much clients asking me if I do things with clients. It’s in dating people ask if I fool [00:27:00] around with my clients. I’m like, okay, so no, it is just like a therapist for just talk…
Kristen: Yeah. They’ll ask me if I’m in the room, and that’s a no too, but yeah, there are some people , they’re like, I don’t know what I don’t know. So are you in the room? Are you doing things , no. Nope. Never. I don’t cross that line. Um, so anyway, so not that kind of tag team, but we can help each other out there. For the listeners, how do people get ahold of you?
Timmy: Yeah, they can. Um, my website is TimmyGibson.com and that’s one way they can message me straight from the site. Uh, I do have a YouTube channel, a do a weekly, um broadcast, a show called The Timmy Gibson Show.
Kristen: You’ve got a friend on there with you right?
Timmy: Yeah. It’s about middle-age life and dealing with issues and dating and sex and marriage, all of it. If we talk about all of it. Um, so yeah, so YouTube and then Instagram. It’s Timmy Gibson. Just look me up. You know, you’ll find me. You can just Google my name actually. You can just Google Timmy. And put the word –
Kristen: T, I, M, M, Y,
Timmy: T, I, M, M, Y. Put KC on it, or put Timmy Kansas City, Timmy [00:28:00] weddings. Timmy matchmaker. I mean, literally Timmy, anything. Timmy, anything and thank goodness I have good analytics and it’ll pop up.
Kristen: Good SEO. Well that’s if you’re in Kansas city, cause I’ve got a nationwide, well actually, international reach on the podcasts, I’m looking at my numbers and seeing people from all over the globe listening. I think it’s sometimes friends that are on vacation.
Kristen: Especially my, my, uh, my British boyfriend, I’ve got out there and he listens when he’s traveling, so shout out to you, Elvis.
Timmy: That’s awesome. and Facebook, of course. Yeah, you can search me on Facebook.
Kristen: Okay, perfect. Well, this was a great conversation.
Timmy: Oh cool.
Kristen: I’m so glad that you came over today and Hey, I’ll look forward to being on your show, so
Timmy: Hey, no, you will be.
Kristen: Okay. Awesome. Thanks again, Timmy.
Timmy: You’re welcome.